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Discectomy - After the Operation

scissorhands, I hear you! I had exactly the same response to the Nerve block. Incredible pain at the time, followed by a short, few (wonderful) hours of no pain (thank you, anaesthetic), followed by excruciating pain, followed by well, no change, back to the same pain as before...

jess22 I think you have it spot on. My physio describes the niggles as 'flare ups'. They seem to come and go, sometimes for a reason (eg carrying too much, sitting too long at work) and sometimes for no reason at all. Most, most frustrating. Every time I think I am getting back to a 'normal' life I get a 'flare up' again and feel like I have taken huge steps back.. But then I go forward again. It's a slow process, that's for sure.

'Comfy' sofas are certainly pure Evil post-discectomy. Four months after my op, I can only just sit on my squishy sofa and even now I can only sit for a little while before I have to get up. Just too hard on the old spine. The firm chair is your friend.
 
Now everyone has contributed to the 'nerve flare up' debate I feel a lot better. I had an assessment today (its a secret) and asked about the continued pain in my left leg, the consultant said it could still be nerve damage or maybe another disc problem. Don't know why I asked now, I wanted to know whether it was another disc problem or not another disc problem.

Back to work tomorrow, but only for 3 hours. Have really pushed myself into complete recovery. Managed a 3 mile walk yesterday (my birthday treat) and didn't suffer too much afterwards. Feeling pretty good about it at the moment as I seem to be making definite progress, and I hate it when I say things like that because then it all falls apart again.

Decided the best method is keep trying to do 'normal' stuff and if that fails, take a break and have another go. Feeling sorry for scissorhands, all those raised hopes that come crashing down. I hope you don't have to wait too long for someone to rescue you.

By the way, do you get better treatment if you scream and wail with pain, I could never manage that and felt it disadvantaged me. Pre oppers, if it does work scream and yell for all you're worth. Hope your misery will be over soon Ali. x
 
HI All


Does anyone know when you can return to driving after a L5/S1 discectomy. I had mine done 4 weeks ago and I'm going out of head not being to get anywhere without relying on my husband. I called the doctor who advised me to call the physio so i called physio who advised me to call the surgeon - so I spoke to the surgeons secretary and she couldn't advise me until she had spoken to the surgeon and she promised to call me back which she hasn't; as I explained to her I feel well enough and the leg pain is no worse (slightly better) than before the operation.

Any views would be greatly appreciated

Thank you
 
in terms of driving....i was told to go ahead as soon as i felt able to. i think it's a case of being able to sit comfortably for a long enough period of time. the drug withdrawals were probably more of a hindrance initially! i think i waited about 6 weeks in the end. in fact, i remember driving to my 6 week check with the consultant and i think that was the first long-ish journey i did. definitely plan for eventualities like getting stuck in unexpected traffic though, so you don't over do it.

a good friend of my had a baby by c-section on the same day i had my op. our recovery for things like lifting and driving was really similar. surprising given the size of thing that came out of her compared to the little bit of disc that came out of me!

olli...there is a fire engine outside my front door as i type. i have no idea why, can't smell burning, but it is making me think of you!

jess xx
 
Hi topracket.

In my case, I was told not to drive for a month. I would not have wanted to drive any earlier than that and even now (4 months post-op) driving for longer than about 30 mins is very hard. What I found difficult was turning to look behind me when changing lanes.
 
I was told to drive when i felt comfortable, and was certain there was no weakness in my leg.
I did leave it for the recommended 6 weeks, i drove after that and have had no problem with driving. They also say to start with just small journeys first.
Even though i still have pain, i am continuing to drive and find its ok, just short periods, no long distances.

I hope you are all ok, sending love to you xx
 
Jess22,

It will be some burnt toast.


Olli
 
Hi All,

Well i had some treatment and she said that my right hamsting is very tight. Also she told me that when you walk slow doing shopping for example you put a lot of pressure into your legs and lower back. I sort of new this already, i've told the wife i am not shopping anymore, i hate it anyway.


Hope everyone is good

Olli
 
Thank you all for you advice. I went for a little drive today and all was fine. I wouldn't want to do more than 20 mins at a time though. It was so nice to be outside and independant again - I was getting to the stage of feeling really fed up but now I can see light at the end of the tunnell

How is everyone else getting on??

x
 
Hiya,
Have been reading all your posts to keep up with everyones progress although havn't posted as I had a case of 'headupmyownarseitis' (this is a little known medical condition, however if its good enough for my consultant its good enough for me!)
Greg - glad to hear you have a date
Scissorhands - sorry to hear your the NRB didn't give you more relief
Ali - I have my apt with God next week & boy is he gonna get it if he continues to a**e around. I have been advised to discuss 2nd opinion with my GP as my consultant is likely to refer me to a colleague (friend) who will back him all the way
Melza - How did work go? I am returning myself in just over 2 weeks time. (complete with stick / numb fingers / incontinence ? pain & tingling etc ) It was either that or finish on the grounds of incapability Still on the upside I have apt with rheumatologist on 15th so hopefully he may restore my faith & actually look as though he is paying attention.
Oli - I shouldn't laugh I know but your toast comment made me giggle. Hands up, I have been one of the red faced nurses you & your colleagues across the country encounter on nights who cause chaos burning their toast

To everyone else hi & hope you are as well as can be.

Tracey xx
 
Glad to hear all went well for you topracket. I have been driving for around 3 weeks now & it is so nice to be independant. Although I have to sat i'm not to keen on my car turning into Moms taxi again x
 
I too have a prolapsed disc L5 nerve impingement and have had footdrop, sciatica , pain in hip and lower back pain since Oct 2007.My left leg is weaker than my right and i have loss of balance daily, usually in the form of staggering, it happens so often i literally just stagger a couple of steps , sometimes randomly. Since i have been off work for 3 months now and had 14 weeks off sick previously i was referred to occ health and had a medical of which the outcome was i had a loss of proprioperception in my left foot and may need a discectomy . Previous to this medical i had my 3rd lumbar epidural since Jan 2008 which clearly had no effect.
I saw my consultant last week and he totally disagreed with the occ health doctor who recommended i don't go back to work as i was at risk of falling over, didn't examine me and sent me for another MRI scan, to determine if surgery is needed.
As my job is on my feet all day work still won't let me go back even part time and i have asked HR to get occ health to give me another medical to determine who is right about the proprioperception issue , when i phoned occ health they were aghast that i wsn't having physio...
My back pain is variable depending on what i do, better if i swim but i also have episodes of getting locked bent over, needing diazapam to unlock it, also i have varying degrees of foot pain ( can be excruitiating) and toe numbness.I take co-codamol or mix of ibuprofen and paracetamol on a good day
I find out if i need an op next week and am torn between total panic and hope! Does anyone know what the options for treatment are between lumbar epidurals and surgery if any?
Wookie
 
Proprio what?? Bet that word doesn't even fit onto your sick certificate Wookie. Sounds like you've been given the run around to me, but then I usually make those sort of unhelpful comments. I don't understand why you haven't had physio and you don't say whether you've had an MRI scan, this is usually the turning point in your treatment, although I could be wrong. I suspect you will be offered an epidural pain relief thingy and if that doesn't work (and depending on the MRI results) they will discuss surgery. And you may have noticed from previous posts that you really have to be a pest to get appointments. Not sure what your GP has been doing all this time but I don't think he/she has been doing enough.

I know I'm being boring but remember that when you've seen your consultant you must be careful what kind of treatment you accept. If they have treated you with epidural/nerve root block they are no longer under pressure to operate on you. I will be testing this system when I see the consultant on 2nd April as my 18 week target is up in the middle of April...if I have to have surgery I can't imagine it will be before then. Apparently they have to treat you privately otherwise, but we shall see.

I've been taking Folic Acid for over a week now and I think there is an improvement in nerve irritation, until I went back to work that is. I still think its worth taking so thanks to whoever for that suggestion.

Ali how are you, have you seen our mate yet. I couldn't see any mention of it on here. Do tell.

Tracey1, a private message for you dear.
 
Im at college (sports course) , and in real pain, my legs are killing me and the pain in my hips are sore.
My op is on the 19 april. Today i could'nt do tennis and football and was told why ?
they have been given 5 letters from the hospital saying about my back and leg pain. But today i went to get a ball, limping to to get it, and was told that there nothing wrong with my back and should take part in everything !!!!!!!
Im so angry ! and the person is head of dept
 
Hi Melza have checked my messages but unfortunately yours hasn't arrived as yet
 
Hi Melza,
Have had 3 epidurals and 2 MRI scans, i am actually a private patient as i get it with work, so i know i am luckier than most. As for the loss of proprioperception apparently it refers to how your body reacts to changes in environment ie walking across a carpet and then adjusting to a rug on that carpet... usually your body adjusts unconsciously so you don't go flying.....
Is it me or does anyone else feel intimidated when they see consultants? Mine just dismissed the occ health doctors diagnosis and made me feel about 5!
 
Hey Melza, no not seen him yet, have got my MRI scan on monday.
Next outpatient appointment is on the 1st may, so then i should find out what is giving me all this jip!
I am on a barrage of painkillers just to get through the day, am thoroughly fed up!
Anyways, how are you doing my lovely? I see you are excited that your masochist physio is leaving lol!!


Hey tracey, how are you doing honey? I wouldnt like to be your doctor if he says the wrong thing to you! But good on you, i have learnt a very valuable lesson with doctors, never take what they say at face value.

P.S. I think it was Jess22 who mentioned the folic acid
 
Am I the only person who responds to a post and then has to scroll back up to get the persons name right.

Gregdfc (I think), I'm really sorry you're having all this confusion, especially as you have to deal with the consequences. You really need to find someone who knows what they're talking about rather than trying to do normal stuff, if you're in a lot of pain you need to find out what the problem is in case you cause further damage.

Wookie (I think), you obviously haven't reached the grand age of 50 yet otherwise you'd be arguing with doctors and consultants cause they've hacked you off. I have put a curse on them all so hopefully one day they'll have a nasty little disc problem too one day, soon. I'm glad the stumbling around has a proper name, when I had that I felt like an old drunk and it still happens when I walk too much.

Tracey1, maybe I did the message wrong or sent it to the wrong person. I worry that people from work might read my messages but what the heck. I went back to work on Monday with agreements from the appeal and occy health doc that I won't be working on my original desk until its been adapted.....so guess where I was working! I give up! Now have to write to my managers so that I cover myself in case I get further injuries. It was really nice to be back in the fold again though, but still thinking I shall lose my job in the end.

Ali, I was doing really well with pain but its all getting aggravated again now (huge sulk), returned to medicating at night which is a big step backwards for me. Never mind, one day I shall look back on all this and laugh...ha ha ha ha ha ha
 
Hi all,
my first post so be gentle!

I have read with interest most of this thread. like a lot of people I am at the stage now where i have my micro discectomy coming up in a couple of weeks but i cannot get over how many people keep telling me i should consider other options and surgery is the last resort....so i am looking for advice....my gut instinct is to trust the experts.

to give you a brief history...and it is brief. past 3 months suffered intermittent back spasms that lasted about 2 days then everything back to normal, playing sport, running etc no problem but was confused as to cause of intermittent issues.

about 3 weeks ago whilst bent over put back out completely, agony like i've never had.

after this over last 3 weeks had 3 physio sessions / week on companys private health scheme. outcome was physio concerned about lack of improvement suggested surgery might end up being only option. as part of the private health scheme after 9-10 physio sessions you must go see a consultant to get authorized for more physio.

went to see consultant who immediately sent me for MRI scan which i had same day (last week) got results back which were amazing...never seen an MRI scan before how cool is that technology!!!! anyway after looking at the images the consultant who came across as a very nice bloke basically said, L5 disc has severley prolapsed, only two options were root block injection which he said was not that effective for most or a micro discectomy which was.

he said physio would not in my case solve the issue.

so i now have the op booked within next 2 weeks. my gut feeling is that given that i only prolapsed the disc 4 weeks ago now and have been lucky in having private health cover to get an MRI scan and expert diagnosis done so quickly that i should go ahead and have this sorted.

.....but then i keep reading all the -ve posts and thinking "have i been too hasty? should i look for alternatives?" but then i think what alternatives? my physio basically said i needed surgery, the consultant says the same based on the overwhelming MRI evidence so surely in my case i should stop fretting and just get on with it? in my eyes getting it taken care off sooner rather than later and reducing the irratation on the nerve can only be a good thing but then who knows.

any advice welcomed.
 
Hi to you all especially jayne69
I had my op (discectomy L5S1) on 16th march and was discharged on 19th, feeling ok tired and sore from surgery, haven't had any pain episodes that i had before i went in. still hobbling around using crutches and have a corset to wear for 6weeks, the hardest bit is trying to do things slowly as you cant run before you can walk! Keeping topped up with painkillers thought I'd be able to drop some of them but seem to be on more at the moment. Have got disolvable stitches which will need checking next tuesday cant have bath /shower till wound has healed. OT dept gave me lots of goodies to bring home to make life easier; long shoe horn, gadget to pull on socks, perching stool and a hi riser toilet seat, have to give back after 3 months and am very greatful for the use of them. can at least get myself dressed and use the toilet by myself now, was bit embarrasing asking for sons (11 and 13yrs) help when hubby not around.
Good luck to everyone waiting for their ops I have waited long enough for this one and will be behaving myself and doing all my physio and excercises properly.

Audrey
 
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  29. Annie Spa:
    🎉🍒ANNIE SPA🎉🍒 ✅7-1001 SANDHURST CIRCLE✅ 👌SCARBOROUGH ON M1V 1Z6👌 ☎️(437) 818-8896☎️ ☎️(416) 291-8879☎️ (FINCH & MCCOWAN) OPEN 10am to 9pm MONDAY to SUNDAY 🔥✅NEW MANAGEMENT💯NEW GIRLS🔥🔥 🔥GORGEOUS NEW YOUNG ASIAN GIRLS - TODAY’s ROSTER INCLUDES: 🔥 Cici😘A very beautiful and sexy little fangirl, she has a sexy and petite figure, Cici service is first-class, worth having and trying, she belongs to the elite👍She is very friendly, very cute and exquisite little model!!🥰Real pictures
  30. NewOriental:
    THURSDAY at 🍏💚NEW ORIENTAL SPA💚🍏: EMMA, HAPPY, LULU & PHOENIX. 10 East Wilmot St, Unit 26, Richmond Hill, on ☎️ 647-381-2688 ☎️ EMMA is a young & pretty Chinese babe with very liberal services. HAPPY is a slim Korean lady with great massage skills & lots of extra fun. LULU is a friendly and very sexy Vietnamese girl. She is a lot of fun, and can be wild at times.
  31. bnwellness_wilson:
    Blue Nile Wellness Center, we have 4 young girls are working today, young cute Ivy with curve body and young sweet Japanese Lily 36DD, sexy Coco and Pretty GFE Ella are providing deep tissue and sensual massage. Pls call 416-3985777 book appointment and walk in always welcome, back entrance and parking available. 350 Wilson Ave North York
  32. Dreaminn:
    THURSDAY at💭𝗗𝗥𝗘𝗔𝗠 𝗜𝗡𝗡 𝗪𝗘𝗟𝗟𝗡𝗘𝗦𝗦 𝗦𝗣𝗔💭: EVA, KELLY & VIVI. 10225 Yonge St (North of Major Mackenzie), Richmond Hill, ON ☎️ 𝟲𝟰𝟳-𝟴𝟮𝟵-𝟮𝟵𝟴𝟯 ☎️ EVA is a slim, pretty & sexy Asian girl. She has excellent bbbj skills if you are nice and clean, and can perform like a champion. KELLY is a young & pretty Asian girl, very slim model figure, 5’2” with unreal bbbj skills & very liberal services.
  33. SunriseRH:
    THURSDAY at SUNRISE SPA: HELEN, MICHELLE, RIYA & SUMMER. 10 East Wilmot St, Unit 27, Richmond Hill, on ☎️ 647-325-8086 ☎️ HELEN is a young, slim & very sexy Vietnamese lady. She not only looks good, she IS good. MICHELLE is a young, curvaceous beauty, 5’2” & 130Lbs, 37DDD-31-41, a trim waist, and a nice butt. Come and be pampered. RIYA is a dynamic black lady with nice D Cups
  34. ASPA:
    𝗧𝗛𝗨𝗥𝗦𝗗𝗔𝗬𝗔𝗧 𝐀 𝐒𝐏𝐀: Fox, Coco & 𝗯𝗲𝘀𝘁 𝗺𝗮𝘀𝘀𝗮𝗴𝗲 𝗥𝗮𝗰𝗵𝗲𝗹[/color] 🅰️𝐀 𝐒𝐏𝐀🅰️, 28 South Unionville Ave, Unit 5, Markham. 🅰️𝗖𝗮𝗹𝗹 𝟲𝟰𝟳-𝟳𝟮𝟵-𝟲𝟲𝟬𝟲 𝗼𝗿 𝘁𝗲𝘅𝘁 𝟲𝟰𝟳-𝟴𝟯𝟵-𝟱𝟵𝟲𝟲🅰️ FOX is 26 years old with 34C’s, stands 164Cm tall and weighs 54Kg. Fox is very friendly and can provide a great girlfriend experience.
  35. HolidaySpa:
    Thursday at 🌴😎🌅𝓗𝓸𝓵𝓲𝓭𝓪𝔂 𝓢𝓹𝓪🌅😎🌴3517 Kennedy Rd, Unit 4, Scarborough ☎️𝟰𝟯𝟳-𝟮𝟰𝟳-𝟭𝟭𝟵𝟵☎️Cindy & Jenny. Cindy is a slim & incredibly sexy lady with a smile that will melt your heart, & an ass that will fire up your spirit. Her services are among the best! Jenny has a medium build, nicely curved with a slim waist, pretty face, and very flexible skills. Jenny will make you very happy.
  36. ForeverWarden:
    Thursday at 🫦❤️🔴🟥♾️𝓕𝓞𝓡𝓔𝓥𝓔𝓡 𝓢𝓟𝓐♾️🟥🔴❤️🫦🫦2190 Warden Ave, Unit 201, Scarborough 𝟰𝟭𝟲-𝟴𝟬𝟬-𝟳𝟴𝟴𝟳: Cindy, Sofia & Tracy. Cindy is a slim beauty, 5’4”, natural C Cups & wonderfully long nipples. Her massage is nice, her bbbj will drive you wild & her cfs finish is a dream come true. Sophia is a sweet & pretty Chinese lady with natural B Cups and an awe-inspiring smooth rounded ass.
  37. Red Rose Spa:
    🌸 We have 5 hot brown girls today 🌸 CHASIDY, LUCY, PAOLA, AMANDA, MAY, KIRAN, NISHA, ANGEL 🌸 2588 Birchmount 🌸 2 Invergordon 🌸 647-702-8800 🌸 Please visit for a great erotic massage
  38. Peony Garden Spa:
    🌸3 GIRLS AVAILABLE TODAY 🌸 NANCY: A SMALL PETITE CURVY VIETNAMESE GIRL, NO TALLER THAN 5'2, VERY FRIENDLY, FUN AND OPEN MINDED 🌸 SELINA: A TALL SLENDER ASIAN GIRL, 5'6 AND ABLE TO PROVIDE AN RMT LIKE MASSAGE 🌸 ELLA: A PETITE YOUNG CHINESE GIRL THAT IS A POPULAR FAVOURITE 🌸 PEONY GARDEN SPA 🌸 3477 KENNEDY ROAD UNIT 4 🌸 (416) 335-6093 🌸
  39. Endless Joy Spa:
    ✨✨✨✨✨[GRAND OPENING]✨✨✨✨✨ 💞Endless Joy Spa💞 🎇 (155 East Beaver Creek Rd Unit #8, Richmond Hill) 416-731-8565🎇10am-2am,New First Day Young Slim Sexy Thai Girl Janice, Slim Sexy Chinese Kiki, Slim Petite Chinese Suki, Tall Slim Sexy Chinese Kelly, Young Sexy Chinese Abie.
  40. Sparkling Spa:
    50 LOCKRIDGE AVE UNIT 8!! INTERNATIONAL GIRLS FOR A VARIETY OF APPETITES!!! MUI PICANTE STELLA IS HERE TODAY!!!☎️(905) 604-8186 Spa Land Line☎️ ☎️(437) 446-6688 NEW Spa Cell Phone 50 LOCKRIDGE AVE UNIT#8 NO SPA LIKE US ANYWHERE NEAR US
  41. bumika.vashi:
    VASHI NAVI MUMBAI FULL SERVICE :oops: TeleGram: @BUMIKAVASHI ☎️ WhatsApp9️⃣9️⃣3️⃣0️⃣9️⃣1️⃣2️⃣6️⃣6️⃣9️⃣
  42. Sparkling Spa:
    0 LOCKRIDGE AVE UNIT 8!! INTERNATIONAL GIRLS FOR A VARIETY OF APPETITES!!! SEXY SASSY SERVICE QUEEN JENNIFER & KOREAN BLASIAN ALIYAH WAITING FOR YOU!!!☎️(905) 604-8186 Spa Land Line☎️ ☎️(437) 446-6688 NEW Spa Cell Phone 50 LOCKRIDGE AVE UNIT#8 NO SPA LIKE US ANYWHERE NEAR US
  43. Lily Spa:
    ❤️ KAJAL, CAMILLA and KK are here today for your massage needs ❤️ Lily Spa ❤️ 2190 McNicoll ❤️ Scarborough ❤️ M1V 5M2 ❤️ (647) 531-8288 ❤️
  44. Endless Joy Spa:
    ✨✨✨✨✨[GRAND OPENING]✨✨✨✨✨ 💞Endless Joy Spa💞 🎇 (155 East Beaver Creek Rd Unit #8, Richmond Hill) 416-731-8565🎇10am-2am,Tonight have New Young Thai Girl Janice after 7:30pm, Slim Sexy Chinese Kiki, Slim Petite Chinese Suki, Tall Slim Sexy Chinese Kelly, Young Sexy Chinese Abie.
  45. Red Rose Spa:
    🌸 We have 5 hot brown girls today 🌸 ASHA, PAYAL PEARL, MONIKA, KIRAN, AMANDA, MALAY, NISHA, SANA, ANGEL 🌸 2588 Birchmount 🌸 2 Invergordon 🌸 647-702-8800 🌸 Please visit for a great erotic massage
  46. SpringGreen.:
    Spring Green Spa - 72 Gerrard St W. 2/Fl - 647-891-0699Today we have 5 girls on wednesday: New Polish gir sasa 💋💋angel- Tanned Spanish beauty with large melons and a fun booty too Wendy- exotic goddess with a gymnasts body and corresponding flexibility CiCi- Exotic beauty with great service and...
  47. SunriseRH:
    WEDNESDAY at SUNRISE SPA: LULU, MICHELLE & SUMMER. Also NEW Girl Lulu after 2pm. 10 East Wilmot St, Unit 27, Richmond Hill, on ☎️ 647-325-8086 ☎️ LULU is a friendly and very sexy Vietnamese girl. She is a lot of fun, and can be wild at times. MICHELLE is a young, curvaceous beauty, 5’2” & 130Lbs, 37DDD-31-41, a trim waist, and a nice butt. Come and be pampered.
  48. Jenny’s Spa:
    🎉🍒JENNY’S SPA🎉🍒 ✅5170 DUNDAS STREET WEST✅ 👌ETOBICOKE ONTARIO M9A 1C4👌 ☎️(647-893-5196)☎️Call or Text ☎️(437-888-3759)☎️Call Only (ETOBICOKE) OPEN 10am to 9pm MONDAY to SUNDAY 🔥✅GRAND OPENING💯NEW GIRLS EVERYDAY🔥EXCELLENT MASSAGE + SERVICE QUEENS NOW AVAILABLE AT JENNY’S SPA FOR ALL YOUR MASSAGE AND SPECIAL EXTRA NEEDS🔥💯😘🔥❤️👌 🔥TWO BEAUTIFUL NEW YOUNG ASIAN GIRLS EVERYDAY🔥REAL PICTURES OF ATTENDANTS💯💯💯 - TODAY’s ROSTER INCLUDES: 🔥 Coco😘- A young cute blonde Asian girl maki
  49. Moneylee:
    All season wellness center : young girl pretty face nice figure Thai deep massage Helen,Young girl big breasted beautiful buttocks charming temperament summer ,Young girl Big breasted saucy naughty Ella , Enchanting sexy petite deep massage Sherry ,address: #5-30 Rambler dr Brampton ,Ontario L6W 1E2☎️4376655510 👅👅🦵🦵🈵🈵👄👄
  50. Moneylee:
    Full season wellness center: New Young girl big breasted beautiful buttocks charming temperament big boobs Rose,Young girl big breasted beautiful buttocks charming temperament big boobs Julie ,Young girl Big-breasted big big butts Aris ,Young beautiful face sexy body and good deep massage maggie,Enchanting sexy petite deep massage Mary. 🏠 2560 Shepard ave Mississauga unit 1 ☎️ 4379857899 👄👄🦵🦵🈵🈵👅👅
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