Restless leg syndrome

[The fish guy]

I have clients with RLS and have heard that electric nerve stimulation could be beneficial. Anyone know anything about using this technique (TENS Unit etc) or which acupoints should be stimulated?

 

[Andersonymous]

I know this isn't a direct answer to your question but I will share this with anyway in the hopes that it can help your client. I'm not even convinced there is such a thing as "Restless Leg Symptom." I'm pretty sure it's just another "disease" the pharma cartel "made up" in order to sell more pills.

If you have people that have tension in their legs have them try these four things:

1) less coffee or massageplanetfeine of any kind.

2) less sodium

30 Less sugar and fatty foods

3) more cardio boosting exercise.

Throw in a good stress reducing massage technique and I think the majority of these people will be "cured." I'd be willing to bet the farm on it.

 

[irockj0rsockz]

I'm not even convinced there is such a thing as "Restless Leg Symptom."

I have a client who truely does have RLS. Her description of it makes it seem as if it is some kind of nerve problem. She says that it feels as if insects are crawling up and down her legs. She also has the sensation of heat and typical nerve symptoms such as tingling. She says that the reason she needs to move her legs is to deal with the sensations.

Now....that said....I also believe that all of the TV and magazine ads lead people to believe that they need drugs that they don't. They are very misleading. Someone watching them will think....."gee...I need to move my legs at night, I must need this drug." or "Yeah...I occasionally can't sleep....I must need a pill."

Angie

 

[Barbiee?]

Oh I don't doubt that people can have these symptoms, I just don't think it's always a disease. As I stated I think a lot of this stuff can be treated by doing the four steps I mentioned. Ask her how much coffee she drinks, how much sodium is in her diet. Ask her about her sugar intake and if she exercises and does cardio. Ask her about the stress in her life. See what she says. All of these can cause those specific symptoms. Combine any of those four and you can really have a hypertensive symptomology. RLS is nothing but a brand name for a set of symptoms. Often the symtoms might be a response to other drugs they are taking for other maladies. There are a lot of side effects to our prescription drug culture.

It's all about taking personal responsibility for our health. Most Americans do rely on the "take a pill" mentality. Sometimes the best thing for restless legs is a jog around the park.

That said I am sure there are people who have nerve damage from compression due to any number of situations, I doubt it's the epidemic we see in the commercials. But I am willing to bet a good deal of potential RLS sufferers eat too much sugar and junk food, drink too much coffee and don't get any cardio. Doing these will often give you similar symptoms.

 

[Mommy to my Kailyn]

For what it's worth, my client is a 30 something yr old female who takes no other medications. She exercises regularly and from all appearances has a healthy diet and lifestyle. Her stress levels from what she tells me are normal.

t102

Angie

 

[Mrs. Brightside]

I'm not even convinced there is such a thing as "Restless Leg Symptom." I'm pretty sure it's just another "disease" the pharma cartel "made up" in order to sell more pills.

RLS is nothing but a brand name for a set of symptoms.

Considering the definition of syndrome is "a group of symptoms that together are characteristic of a specific disorder, disease, or the like" [dictionary.com] I think it's a pretty accurate description .

My mom has suffered from RLS for many years. She started getting the symptoms in her late 50's infrequently, and chalked it up to tired legs. By her early 60's it became unbearable. This is a woman who lived with my retired father in southern Missouri on the edge of the ozarks. Civilization was a 30-40 min car drive, so she kept herself active by hiking in the woods, maintaining walking trails, and daily walks to the end of their "driveway" (a 3 mile round trip.) For health reasons, my dad was on a restricted sodium diet... so as the cook, my mom was too. She's never had much of a sweet tooth either, and probably eats better than 95% of the people I know (my dad had an incredible garden.) massageplanetfeine? She's the type to make a pot of coffee in the morning, but if it's cooling off by the time she gets to the second cup, then the rest ends up sitting there till she does the dishes after dinner that night - so some massageplanetfeine, but not a tremendous amount.

Her RLS untreated, will keep her awake through the night, practically to exhaustion and tears. Walking, hot baths, cold packs, epsom salts, lotions and liniments do nothing. She has been on one of the big medications for RLS for a number of years now, and it's the only thing that lets her sleep at night. Considering the cost of the medicine and her fixed income, I guarantee you that if she had an alternative, she'd be using it. In fact, I've searched for massage and RLS info before so I could possibly offer her something, but never came up with much. I'd be thrilled to know if anyone comes up with anything helpful.

Thanks .

PS - She has no issue with the "uncontrollable urge to gamble..." or that OTHER side effect you hear about. She does get drowsy depending on when she takes the medication, but that's much more livable than the heebie-jeebies she was experiencing .

 

[b r]

I'm sorry your Mom has had such a tough time of this. I don't doubt that there are some people that have this "mystery" illness. I guess my cynicism comes from seeing the drug companies exploit it and in essence running a bunch of other symptoms that could be treated otherwise into their umbrella for pure profit sake. People jacked up on coffee or sodium with twitching legs see the commercial and go "That's me!" and then pick up another double latte and box of Kripsy Kremes on their way to the pharmacy at Rite Aid. I know if I was to drink half a cup of coffee at any time of the day I'd have insomnia and twitches for 3 days, believe me it's happened. Needless to say I don't touch the stuff at all. So unless someone totally takes that off the table I still would consider that a possible culprit.

In my experience I have encountered many who were just symptomatic to the conditions I stated so I guess it's always worth a try to elimanate the obvious first. Most cases I have seen were related to acute hypertension usually due to bad diet and no exercise and in several cases to people going through drug and alcohol withdrawl and were short term and usually treatable homeopathically. I still believe that would take care of many of those types of symptoms and would always think of drugs as the very last resort.

 

[Ginger Billy]

I didn't mean to disrespect the intentions of the OP's question. Getting back to the original question, I did a little snooping aorund about using a TENS machine on RLS and found this:

http://www.helpguide.org/life/restless_leg_syndrome_rls.htm

Self-care Tips for Restless Legs Syndrome
Develop an exercise program that relieves the RLS symptoms.
Wrap your legs in ace bandages, or wear compression stockings or tight pantyhose.
Take iron supplements for low iron levels - Be sure to get tested first because too much iron in your system can be dangerous.
Reduce massageplanetfeine, alcohol, and tobacco use – Cut out coffee, chocolate, and massageplanetfeinated soda, particularly in the evenings. These substances often increase symptoms.
Go to bed before you get too tired.
Keep a regular sleep schedule.
Tips at Bedtime for Relieving the Symptoms of Restless Legs Syndrome

Move around - Pace, walk, or jog for a few minutes to relieve discomfort.
Stretch your legs, do knee bends, or rotate your ankles.
Massage your legs.
Relax with meditation, yoga, or deep breathing.
Apply heat or cold (whichever feels best) - Take a bath or soak your feet in hot water before bed, briefly use a heating pad or cold compresses, or apply a hot water bottle.
Lie on your side with a pillow between your knees to initiate sleep.
Apply electrical stimulation to feet and legs - Transcutaneous Electric Nerve Stimulation (TENS) helps to reduce nighttime leg jerking in patients experiencing severe RLS. You apply electrical stimulation for 15 to 30 minutes with a portable, bedside TENS unit.

It doesn't say which points to use the TENS, although my gut tells me to place one about 4 or 5 inches above the top of the patella on the quads and another about 4 inches below the knee underneath the leg on the midpoint of the gastrocnemius. I'd use round 2 inch pads.

A good many sites said the same thing I did about massageplanetfeine, diet and exercise plus mentioned other things like those mentioned here. I think it's a pretty good summation.

 

[Mark Anthony]

Should be noted that having too little calcium, magnesium in the system can cause these symptoms too. Sometimes people are actually taking enough of these minerals, but absorption is poor. Vitamin C and MSM (which we were talking about in another thread) can really help with absorption of these minerals and relieve restless leg symptoms.

Stacey (speaking from experience)

 

[ted j]

My two cents

I am very healthy person; I practice different energy modalities, and strongly belief in mind over matter. In the past, I tend to look down onto other people’s symptoms or pain. However, that is what I learned. Yes, medicine does not understand a whole lot about the human body and health. Therefore, a lot of diagnoses are just labels and there is no known cures. I too know a person who suffers mysterious nerve condition with all symptoms described above. Trust me, it’s real for him. And he tried you name it. All kinds of diets, doctors, energy, more then I can list here. None of it helped so far. I do believe though that nothing is beyond healing, and everyone can become whole again. It’s a journey where a person has to try and try different things. And sometimes what helps one, doesn’t help other. Sorry, I wish I had a better answer.
As I am writing that, Tibetan Bowls Sound Massage keeps popping up in my mind. It is just so profoundly relaxing, and deeply affects the nervous system. I can’t say for sure, I had not treated any one with these symptoms. The friend I described above is in other state. But worth trying. All my love!

 

[Pompal 09.]

Wow, I am impressed at how these treads travel. I don't usually use chats. Wonderful things! I too found the site elsewhere is talking about. Thank you all for your tremendous help. Aside from magnesium, iron can also be a factor (if the brain recognizes it as such!) and other TENS points are as follows:
Gv 20- loacated on the middle of a line joining the tips of the ears, on the top of the head.
Gb34 - four fingers width below the outside of the knee and just in front of and below the head of the fibula.
B62- In the depression 1/2 a fingers width below the outer ankle bone.
H7- On the little finger side of the forearm on the crease of the wrist
H3- With the elbow flexed, midway between the inner elbow crease and the inner elbow
Ear point- Shennen
SP6 3 fingers width above the inner ankle and just behind shin.

I do have several clients with this issue, and whether it is a symptom (which I believe it is) or a disease, I'd love to find them some relief.

Thanks so much for all the responses. I will be a regular corresponder now!

 

[derfini]

I have a client with RLS, mid-50's, who is super healthy, and refuses to take drugs of any kind. She takes a lot of magnesium and calcium supplements, as well as eating a ton of organic veggies, etc. She said these things all help, but that she still has problems sometimes. Do you all know of any books or articles that describe points more in depth? Any that work particularly well? (we did not learn where specific points are in my school) She's one of my best clients and I'd love to be able to help her more with her RLS if I could.

 

[fat_arsehole]

HI,
I have some suggestions, but the best thing that can be done is to get them on the medication for this problem. My husband has had it for about 7 years, and we tried everything we could think of and that was suggested. We finally gave up after fighting it for 3 years and put him on Requip and Gabapentin. Before that it was just getting worse. Nothing helped. We tried the TENS unit, and it was great while on, but as soon as you took it off it was twice as bad. We tried the diets, the excercise before bed (which makes is much worse, because then your muscles are fatigued which makes it happen faster). We tried yoga, to help him relax, but nothing worked until the medication. I hate medication when it really isn't needed, but this is something that unless you have it, you can't explain what it is like. There were nights that he was about in tears because it was so bad. It is almost like they are getting a shock through their legs it is that type of jerk. I hope your patients gets treatment for it. I wish them the best, it is a hard road to travel.

 

[?Sansa?]

Synchronicities…
I received this mail order magazine I’ve never seen before. Harriet Carter. It has Restless Legs Cream. Claims to give you uninterrupted night sleep. It contains magnesium, vitamin E, lavender oil and other therapeutic ingredients.
It doesn’t let me post a website, but here is a phone 1-800-377-7878. Search for harrietcarter
Best wishes!

 

[brownboy]

Thanks for the info on the cream. I went to the company site. The company that manufactures it is MangiLife. But if anyone is interested in buying it it is cheaper at the Harriet Carter site. Here are the ingredients and info if anyone else is interested in trying:
Product Description : Restless Legs Cream can be massaged into your legs and feet to relieve and soothe the symptoms of restless legs syndrome. Scientifically formulated to allow for absorption of specific vitamins and minerals that provide relief from those painful and annoying sensations. Therapeutic formula is infused with essential oils for relaxation so you can rest comfortably. 4 oz. jar.

Ingredients & Purpose
Water, Aloe Barbadensis Leaf Juice, Polyacrylamide, C13-14 Isoparaffin, Benzocaine HCI, Magnesium Ascorbyl Phosphate, Lavandula Angustifolia (Lavender) Oil, Salvia Officinalis (Sage) Leaf Extract, Cananga Odorata Flower Extract, Anthemis Nobilis Flower Extract, Tocopheryl Acetate (Vitamin E), Folic Acid, Retinyl Palmitate Vitamin A, Propylene Glycol, Laureth-7, Diazolidinyl Urea, Methylparaben, Propylparaben. Vitamin E - for symptoms of RLS, cramps, and muscle spasms, Lavender Oil - for the relaxation or relief of muscle spasms and twitches, also calms and relaxes the body to help with sleep, Magnesium Ascorbyl Phosphate - for symptoms of RLS, paraesthesia of the extremities, muscle twitches, and nocturnal leg cramps, and for symptoms of periodic leg movements (PLMS) and PLMS associated with arousal (PLMS-A), Propylene Glycol - used as a penetration enhancer to allow ingredients to penetrate into the skin and decreases the barrier resistance.

It may not be a cure, but it may be worth a try. Good luck.

 

[GNET Uk - GNETUK.CO.NR]

Sorry, typo..it is MagniLife

 

[seafarer]

This is so interesting to hear about how many different things have worked. Thanks for that info about the meds Jenny. Glad your husband is feeling better.

 

[P3RF3CTLY FLAW3D]

RLS is a dopamine (chemical-hormonal)problem. The spasms in my legs and feet, were so severe I had callouses in the arch part of my feet from the arch hitting the bottom of my shoes due to non-stop severe spasms and could only stand about 4 hrs a day vs the 12 I was used to. The spasms/creepy crawly feelings are generally from the hips all the way down to the feet. Walking out leg cramps work as a nice distraction, but only if you are willing to stay up all night long long. It is very debilitating. I tried all kinds of things for 2 years and was miserable before I actually got diagnosed and on proper medication to control the symptoms. Please don't judge those of us who need medication to manage this condition. I am not lazy, nor responsible and I am so incredibly grateful the pharmacedical companies now have a medication I can take so I can work full time again. Massage is helpful, as many other things, but only in a temporay way.